Since this thread is being hi-jacked by the vocabulary correct, here are a few.

When people ask me, "can I ???". I just simply say, "I don't know, Can you?"

Another is, "oh, I seen that". ugggggg. Duh! I saw that.

I am still undecided about "learnt". I looked it up and it seems like it actually is a word but that was with Wiki.

Guitarpima--We were both grumbling about "I seen that" at the same time.  Great Curmudgeons think alike!  hehe.  Aaaah yeah, this is OT - but it's been fun to vent.  I'm glad I "aksed" our UK friends about the use of language a number of posts back.

Anyways.

Randy B.

[<font]One that really bugs me the most is using "had had". I see this in books everywhere. Is there any reason to use the word "had" twice in a row?

rbowser


Guitarpima--We were both grumbling about "I seen that" at the same time.  Great Curmudgeons think alike!  hehe.  Aaaah yeah, this is OT - but it's been fun to vent.  I'm glad I "aksed" our UK friends about the use of language a number of posts back.

Anyways.

Randy B.

Curmudgeons! LOL!

the use of an apostrophe for plural instead of possessive. "Synth's" in this particular instance, when they meant "Synths." How can that possibly look right to anyone who learned English?

Randy B - I suggest you refer the authors of that site to Lynne Truss's "Eats, Shoots & Leaves - A Zero Tolerance Approach to Punctuation" for a good read!

lapieuvre


Don't be too hard on the language!  English is not my first language...

A feature I would like is The import session data from ProTools.  Or the Tracks archive from Cubase/Nuendo.

You can import certain tracks from another project into a new project. Very useful for team work!

It can only be done if all parties agree.  The project files of any one DAW are proprietary.  Digidesign will have to allow that for it to happen. 

Guitarpima


[<font]One that really bugs me the most is using "had had". I see this in books everywhere. Is there any reason to use the word "had" twice in a row?

Although it is a strange sounding past participle - I think it is technically correct.  As correct as "had given", "had promised" etc.  Its use is mere personal preference - so instead of saying "By the time my Sonar 8.5.3 upgrade had finished installing, I had had a couple beers" I think it much cleaner to say "While waiting on my software to install I drank a couple beers"  - no my computer is not that slow!!

A post that inspires an On Topic response from me:
 
FastBikerBoy said, "...I would like to be able to apply a template to an existing project. For example when I'm tracking I'll have several audio tracks that all output to my sub master buss. When it comes to mixing I then like to output the audio to separate channels on my ZEDR-16 so I can use outboard compressors/effects etc not to mention the delicious EQ on the console. It would be much easier to do if I could have a template of pre-assigned channels to apply to the project rather than going through each channel one at a time..."

Since you have your preferred mixing set up with these particular track assignments, you could adapt your working method a bit to always start a new project with exactly that template you want.  If it turns out you don't need some of the template's tracks and assignments - just delete them as you go.

I rarely use the actual Template option in Sonar though.  Here's my working method - maybe it'll appeal to you, FastBikerBoy:

--I open a recent project which has the layout I know will be a good starting point for a new project.  I select all with Ctrl+A, then delete all data in the project, MIDI and Audio.  In the Tempo View, I delete all tempo changes.  I "Save As" under the name of the new project.

--Result - I'm set to go, with all audio tracks going where I want, all plug-ins in place, all soft synths in the rack ready to be used.

Randy B.

rbowser


A post that inspires an On Topic response from me:

FastBikerBoy said, "...I would like to be able to apply a template to an existing project. For example when I'm tracking I'll have several audio tracks that all output to my sub master buss. When it comes to mixing I then like to output the audio to separate channels on my ZEDR-16 so I can use outboard compressors/effects etc not to mention the delicious EQ on the console. It would be much easier to do if I could have a template of pre-assigned channels to apply to the project rather than going through each channel one at a time..."

Since you have your preferred mixing set up with these particular track assignments, you could adapt your working method a bit to always start a new project with exactly that template you want.  If it turns out you don't need some of the template's tracks and assignments - just delete them as you go.

I rarely use the actual Template option in Sonar though.  Here's my working method - maybe it'll appeal to you, FastBikerBoy:

--I open a recent project which has the layout I know will be a good starting point for a new project.  I select all with Ctrl+A, then delete all data in the project, MIDI and Audio.  In the Tempo View, I delete all tempo changes.  I "Save As" under the name of the new project.

--Result - I'm set to go, with all audio tracks going where I want, all plug-ins in place, all soft synths in the rack ready to be used.

Randy B.

Thanks for the reply Randy. I perhaps didn't make myself clear, what I want to be able to do is change multiple outputs in one go halfway through a project. i.e. when I've finished tracking and about to start mixdown. I know there is the ability to change multi-outs at once but unless I'm missing something that is to either to the same output or a series of outputs. At tracking time I just put everything through my master buss so my channels are free for various inputs and a mixing time I change them to the channels on my mixer so I can use outboard processors and EQ if I wish. It's a sort of hybrid ITB/OTB mixing method that may seem like madness but works well for me. I effectively mix in Sonar but use some outboard gear, almost like the external insert but the output goes there instead.

So when it comes to mixing I want to send various tracks to channels on my console. For example I might put the Kick through channel 1 , Snare on 2, all the toms(recorded on separate tracks) to 3, cymbals to 4. I tend to use 5 & 6 for input from a hardware synth and 7 & 8 as my main outs, so bass might go on 9, guitar 1 on gt 2 on 10, etc. anyway you get the idea. To do this I have to do each track manually one at a time or start a new project using a different template and then export/import the audio, both take a little time. It would be much easier to have a template that I can apply to the project thus changing all the outputs in one easy go. I hope that makes sense. If there's already a way of doing that I'm all ears....... anything to save time.. thanks.

Guitarpima


[<font]One that really bugs me the most is using "had had". I see this in books everywhere. Is there any reason to use the word "had" twice in a row?

I wish I had had the self restraint to ignore this post

FastBikerBoy


I get what you're saying Randy but I do start with a template. It's all set up for the way I track. When I mix I need to change lots of outputs at once for the way I want to work. I want to make use of a great console EQ on tracks and some of my outboard effects as well, it's how the ZEDR-16 was designed to be used, hence my "What do I want next" request.........

OK, FFB - My template project is set up for both tracking and mixing, I thought maybe you could have yours also doing double duty like that.

Randy B.

I haven't read through the entire thread, so some of these ideas have probably already been discussed; apologies if so.

1. Bugs, bugs, bugs: please fix the bugs! Everyone knows V-Vocal crashes all the time, so why won't they fix it?! Chances are it's buffer overflow, pointer mismanagement or memory allocation/deallocation. Fire up the debugger and trace the problems; it's not rocket science.

2. Make everything work properly with Windows 7 64-bit. I bought a new 64-bit machine, so I don't want to be forced use 32-bit software. But I guess this is a transitional phase we're going through.

3. Simplify, don't complexify. There are plenty of suggestions for new features, but more isn't necessarily better. Have you ever considered what encountering Sonar for the first time must be like for someone who's never used a DAW before and doesn't know how a conventional recording studio works? What's equalisation? What's compression? Baffling.

Perhaps Sonar could be programmed with "levels", so you start off in Level 1, nice and simple, then once you've mastered it you can go up to Level 2, where more things become available. This would help beginners and improvers. At the moment they're thrown in the deep end and have to sink or swim. If you want everything, then jump straight to Level 12 or whatever.

4. A big, long, comprehensive PRINTED manual is essential. Sonar 2's manual was just about adequate but since then they've been going downhill. The one for version 8.5 is a joke. (And I don't need it in three languages!) If Cakewalk can't be bothered to write a proper manual themselves, there are plenty of technical authors who could do the job. In the current economic conditions it should be easy to find someone. (Also, a printed manual is a good way of discouraging "pirating". It's neither easy nor cheap to copy a 1,000 page manual. By controlling access to the manual, Cakewalk could reduce the effect of illegal copying, if that's seen as a commercial problem.)

5. Personally I'd rather that new projects opened as Blank rather than Normal. I expect there's a way of changing that, but not having a well-indexed printed manual, I don't know how to do it. And I can't be bothered to spend a long time finding out; instead I just sigh and scroll down. There are probably hundreds of little annoyances like that, despite being a long-time Sonar user, simply because of the lack of documentation.

6. I'd welcome the ability to include text files in a project. Notes about settings, instrumentation, ideas, lyrics etc currently have to be stored in separate text files, or on a piece of paper.

I've been with Sonar since version 2 and I appreciate the way it still works in a very similar way. No radical changes please!

>Perhaps Sonar could be programmed with "levels",
Got this one already:
Music Creator 5
SONAR Home Studio 7
SONAR Home Studio 7  XL
Sonar Studio 8.5
Sonar professional 8.5

1. Ability to turn "automation write" on and off while a project is playing
(The "W" button)

2.Convert the "track folder" concept to a "bus" concept - adjust the "track" concept to today's DAW standards
The "track folder" essentially becomes a "bus" channel with all its controls, and all the included tracks in the folder have as an output that track folder. IF by any chance any programmer of Sonar reads this and doesn't understand what Im saying, take a look at Ableton's Live "group" channels. Essentially this will lead solution of MANY other requests often made here such as "being able to have a bus anywhere in the tracks row and not just in the bottom", "an easy way to see which tracks are output to which busses", etc. etc.
My best of wishes would be in the future to "dump" the whole concept of this "division" of track kinds which belong only to the hardware world. Any track will be able to be routed to any track, and any track can be a send or an output for another track.

3.Ability to "record" anything to audio like an old tape recorder
Discussed many times before, I wish I could just output my "not-well-behaved automation- soft-synth" to a track, hit "record" (currently no button available for soft synths, only for physical audio ins), fiddle its virtual knobs and AT LEAST get some audio recorded (since its automation is not well behaved). Very usefull for spontaneity and improvisation too.

Features that are obviously needed ASAP...
 
US English to Queen's English to Aussie English translator and a Gramer checker that applies all grammer rules.  Lets see what that might do...can do...may do...
 
Poor Bakers...their heads must be spinning...