Staff View

Sonar 8 is awesome!! everything is new and improved and lovely... Except the staff view, which looks just like Home Studio 3, copyright 1994.

15 years, and there hasn't been any improved rhythm recognition, or the amount of viewable staves, or simply an easier way to switch enharmonic equivalents. There are rests and note overlaps where there shouldn't be, and you can't change the controllers unless you open the piano roll.

Why hasn't there been reasonable improvement in 15 years?
Why can't I have small staves and a little zoom window around my cursor like the piano roll?
Why can't I open more than 24 staves at a time?
Why can't I open up a channel's staff in the track window?
Why can't I click on clefs and change them, or meter changes and key signatures?
Why do the instrument names get cut off at the beginning of the staff?
Why isn't there an option for a controller window underneath the staves?
Why can't I move a staff lower or higher to make room for low or high notes?
Why can't I adjust the length of a note by selecting it and altering it with the number pad (could do that in Home Studio 3)?
Why can't it understand that triplets are sometimes 2 notes and a rest?
Speaking of triplets, why can't I make quintuplets or septuplets?
Why doesn't the staff window jump to the staff I select from the right hand list?
Why are the staves in the channel number order, instead of the order I've put them in manually from the track window?


I don't want another sibelius, but I would like to see some streamlining if possible. Cakewalk has the fastest note-entry-by-mouse-clicking I've seen, but it could be even faster.

With a pretty please and a cherry on top,
-Jeff

Hi Jeff-

Actually, there's been a lot of support on this forum for improved notation. I suggest you post an official FR here to add your voice to those of us who'd like to see this. Strength in numbers!

Thanks-

-Susan

Susan, I sure haven't seen "a lot of support." Every year, I've eagerly followed every "will notation finally be addressed in this next upgrade?" only to hear that, once again, notation has been left out. I've seen lots of begging, but most responses from Sonar users in those threads tend to be that it doesn't make sense to spend the development money for notation when you can buy Finale or Sibelius to do the job. I have Allegro (Finale's little brother), but I don't have high end notation needs and don't like to have ANOTHER package to buy upgrades for (and to have to keep key strokes straight from Sonar), just to do simple lead sheets and print outs for things I'm composing, but that are still way beyond Sonar's reach.

Last month, after seeing another forum plea fall on deaf ears, I had to ask myself why I've gone so long hoping that the next upgrade will finally address notation. (And even if notation is improved in the next upgrade or two, how likely is it to be a mature solution right away?) I've started following Logic and Cubase forums to get a better feel of the pros and cons of those packages. The notation problems are DEFINITELY a world of complexity above those asked on this forum. My annual $187 upgrade fee for Sonar plus the upgrade cost of Allegro (or Finale) goes a long way toward the full package of either Logic or Cubase.

I must admit that I do hate to give up the responsiveness of Sonar developers in most every other aspect of their DAW.

In the end, I suspect that most folks who really need notation for their DAW work aren't on this forum but are using Cubase or Logic.

Is there a way to do that? I've always just entered the note, right-clicked and edited the note name. Hardly user friendly.

If cakewalk want to sell more copies of Sonar they should seriously improve the notation features. Imagine the additional sales from school's who find sibelius costly. These kids would become the future users of Sonar.

Plus I would find the notational features very useful!

Me too...

I too long for improved notation. Mostly for input/edit of midi and with the possibility of basic print outs. The display of notes in a hidden midi clip is just one of a number of niggles. I'm also guilty of giving up a little. I submitted feature requests and then watched with bated breath as these were ignored over the years. Then we got to the point where the mere mention of notation or staff in the forum would start a slanging war.

I'm a media composer. I would like reasonable notation to help me get my ideas out there. I've been with Sonar for years, it's the most intuitive daw out there. I applauded when they started talking the talk about being good for media/film composition but in the end this appeared to be straightening out some video bugs. Now for the first time, I find myself looking seriously at alternatives..

There should be a little more give and take. I personally don't need/use 50% of the new features introduced in the last few versions, but I don't complain or suggest that they're not important for others.

An update to notation is long overdue.

I've given up on Cakewalk addressing notation. The sad thing is that now my only option is Cubase. (I don't want to go MAC or I'd definately choose Logic) I just got the baby version of Cubase and I really like Sonar better but I need decent notation to work the way I want to so I'm slowly makeing the swtich. I've been with Cakewalk since the first Windows 3.1 verson. It's really sad the way they dropped such an important ball.

ORIGINAL: msr

I use the staff view quite a bit in Sonar for MIDI editing and it works fine for what it is. However, if I am doing scoring, I just gave up waiting for Cakewalk to do anything more than what they have now and went to Finale. It makes much nicer scores.

msr

I use Sibelius. I find it cumbersome for VST and a few other things although it is ,of course, wonderful for printing. I need a DAW that does tuplets, enharmonics (and many other things) competently enough for composing. I'd still do my printing and some scoring in Sibelius.

ORIGINAL: InstrEd

Please Cakewalk, don't disappoint this time.
If no improvement this time around I will skip Version 9 and see what is in version 10.

Ed

I've been holding out since version 6.

I had a Sax player coming over at the last minute and needed to be able to print out a lead sheet for him - which should have had grace notes on it. Couldn't do it. Had to write it out by hand. To be able to play a MIDI part into Sonar and have it printed out exactly as played would be a great time saver.

I have been asking for this too and I join all who wish the Staff View to be upgraded and improved.

I'd be great if Sonar would support importing and exporting MusicXML format. It would be helpful for both Sibelius and Finale users.
Serge

Yes, the staff view is critical to my work and is the single most important improvement I would like to see in future versions.

ORIGINAL: cityrat

I'll probably get flamed or banned for saying this, but this is the reason I went over to Cubase.

I hope you don't. For the first time since I've been using a Cakewalk sequencer/DAW (Cakewalk Professional for Windows 1.03, 1991) I've had the urge to switch to Pro Tools after I found out that it has a lite version of Sibelius
Serge