Helpful ReplyHot!Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices

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tenfoot
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 02:17:14 (permalink)
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
In 2017, not using social media is probably putting you at a disadvantage. How much is dependent on what you consider relevant or valuable. I know of 3 user moderated SONAR Facebook groups that are arguably more active than the forums and likely share more user generated content. That result isn't unexpected though, Facebook's whole platform is designed around content sharing and community.



I am an avid facebook user. As a marketing tool it is excellent.  As a support medium it is extraordinarily limited and serves more to give the impression of support via occasional, non searchable random responses than actual useful archived problem solving. In this regard the forum is far superior.
 
As to user groups that are more active than the forum, it would be great if you could posts links to these pages! A quick search reveals only pages with at best a few posts a day. Perhaps you are using the new Trump system of estimating attendees:)
 
Regardless, from a support POV, the previously mentioned limitations still apply. A question answered on facebook is useful once, to one person. It is hard to see how Cakewalk's effort spent there is more valuable or useful than increased forum participation.

Bruce.
 
Sonar Platinum 2017-01, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface UFX (ASIO driver), Behringer X32 Producer (WASAPI Driver), Behringer X32 Rack (WASAPI Driver), Novation Ultranova, Yamaha Motif Rack, Yamaha P85 Keyboard, Roland Handsonic HPD-15, Roland A-Pro 300, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
#91
pwalpwal
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 13:54:21 (permalink)
yeah, i use fb, reddit, steam, here, but there's no real official place to get an ad-hoc real-time-ish "chat" with someone official from cw, they're all just places they might show up and respond (ratio of "might" to "will" unique to each)
 

just a sec

#92
azslow3
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 14:40:26 (permalink)
Some time ago here, in Germany, that was a big implicit Facebook ads on TV. Several lengthy discussions,  explanations, etc. I have started to ask around who is really using it. Most have answered that they have an account, but they use it may be once per year... I mean no one in my family, no one from my friends and no one from my colleagues is opening Facebook more that once per month.
 
WhatsUp is in widely use because SMS price here is inadequate. Twitter - again no one...
 
I use Steam. I use Skype (mostly when I help someone from this forum). I am open for new technologies when it make sense. The same I can say about people I know.

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#93
Brian Walton
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 15:28:56 (permalink)
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
ampfixer
Off topic, but it bothers me to hear that you are using the forum, the bakery, steam and Facebook as conduits for customer interaction. I have no idea what avenue to follow when looking for information. I worry that the limited support resources are diluted and that there is a potential for inconsistent communication.
 

 
Follow us where you feel comfortable.
 
While the forum is really setup as a peer to peer platform, Facebook is much more of a direct marketing tool and needs to be handled as such. During our last round of customer interviews (this past month), very few indicated that they were on the forum, but almost all were on Facebook. It's only logical that we participate in the places where our customers congregate. 
 
Now, in regards to my main responsibility, Steam is designed to give developers all the tools they need to create/release/sell/reevaluate/update and communicate with their user base. The built in social media platform is critical for success and is the best way to communicate with users on that channel. That said, non-Steam users won't be missing anything by not following Steam, and probably shouldn't as it differs slightly from direct. 
 
Tying it back to your point of multiple conduits. Steam users may not necessarily be Facebook users as they tend to skew younger. Therefore It would be bad to assume we could ignore the Steam community tools in favor of just Facebook or the forums.
 
ampfixerI don't use social media. Does that put me at a disadvantage when I'm trying to find out whats going on? I'm hearing that there is more interaction via Steam and Facebook. 

 
In 2017, not using social media is probably putting you at a disadvantage. How much is dependent on what you consider relevant or valuable. I know of 3 user moderated SONAR Facebook groups that are arguably more active than the forums and likely share more user generated content. That result isn't unexpected though, Facebook's whole platform is designed around content sharing and community.


Curious where the pool of customer interviews came from.  
 
I don't use Facebook, but perhaps take it a level up...you have to have an email to use any platform.  Cakewalk has an email for all users (also a requirement).  So any broad communication could come via email to hit all users in some way.  
 
Facebook certainly isn't an idea platform to address customer issues.  I'd argue from what I've seen of the platform it is pretty terrible for that kind of support.  
#94
Caa2
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 17:14:11 (permalink)

 

#95
Caa2
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 17:26:37 (permalink)


#96
azslow3
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 17:40:50 (permalink)
It was written several times already that this forum does not represent the majority of Sonar users and we here are aged asocial oldies
But looking at these numbers on Steam, I hope Facebook is more important platform. Otherwise where is the majority?

Sonar 8LE -> Platinum, Windows 10 pro
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#97
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 17:42:46 (permalink)
tenfoot
I am an avid facebook user. As a marketing tool it is excellent.  As a support medium it is extraordinarily limited and serves more to give the impression of support via occasional, non searchable random responses than actual useful archived problem solving. In this regard the forum is far superior.
 
...
 
Regardless, from a support POV, the previously mentioned limitations still apply. A question answered on facebook is useful once, to one person. It is hard to see how Cakewalk's effort spent there is more valuable or useful than increased forum participation.

 
Brian WaltonFacebook certainly isn't an idea platform to address customer issues.  I'd argue from what I've seen of the platform it is pretty terrible for that kind of support.

 
It is a pretty limited platform for support. I don't think you'd find someone at Cakewalk that would disagree.
 
The reality is we still get direct messages from customers on it and those need to be addressed. We quickly try to move people into our standard support system, sometimes logging internally on a customers behalf. This way there's a bit of accountability and less platform noise.
 
I know there were concerns of us stretching our support too thin, but we try to organize these social channels as a funnel.
 
Brian WaltonCurious where the pool of customer interviews came from.

 
Internal analytics and we asked around.
 
Brian WaltonI don't use Facebook, but perhaps take it a level up...you have to have an email to use any platform.  Cakewalk has an email for all users (also a requirement).  So any broad communication could come via email to hit all users in some way.


E-mails aren't fallible. A user could use a junk e-mail they never check or a typo. ISP's can also false flag messages as SPAM and other users opt out of communication from Cakewalk. We e-mailed a lot of SONAR users originally in regards to this thread and people still didn't receive it.   
 
tenfootAs to user groups that are more active than the forum, it would be great if you could posts links to these pages! A quick search reveals only pages with at best a few posts a day.

 
That's why I said arguably ;) It's a bit of a quality vs quantity thing and post counts don't always tell the whole story. There's a lot of positive sub-discussion and exchanges that take place. Even if there is a difference of opinion. Something that the level of anonymity of our forums can sometimes get in the way of. These groups are also entirely user run, so while a Cakewalk person may chime in on occasion it's not 'our show'.
 
The Cakewalk SONAR User Group (CSUG) is pretty active. They have 1961 members. There's some overlap with prominent forum users here. It's been growing pretty steadily too with 29 new members in the last day or so.

Best,

Seth Kellogg 
STEAM Community Manager & LiveOps 
Quality Assurance Engineer
Cakewalk Inc.
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tenfoot
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 18:10:59 (permalink)
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
 
The Cakewalk SONAR User Group (CSUG) is pretty active. They have 1961 members. There's some overlap with prominent forum users here. It's been growing pretty steadily too with 29 new members in the last day or so.




 
Thanks for taking the time to respond, and for the facebook group name Seth - I'll head on over.

Bruce.
 
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#99
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 18:11:40 (permalink)
Caa2

 





Hi Mike,
 
We have approximately 57k users across Music Creator 6 Touch/7 alone. SONAR Home Studio has been available for a few months, with relatively light promotion. More on post counts below.
 
Caa2






We have over 7000 people on the latest incarnation of SONAR on Steam. With a 80% usage rate and a total playtime average of 91.5h and 122.4h median. With 20-40 people using SONAR concurrently at any one time. An average user is expected to use SONAR 1.5 hrs a week. Since you can also load SONAR without Steam running, analytic logs aren't entirely accurate here. What that's telling us is users by and large are using SONAR without issue.
 
Anecdotally, I have over 200 games in my personal Steam account. I've enjoyed and played the majority of them, but I've posted maybe half a dozen times in different communities. Post counts simply don't paint an accurate picture. 
post edited by Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk] - 2017/03/22 19:03:11

Best,

Seth Kellogg 
STEAM Community Manager & LiveOps 
Quality Assurance Engineer
Cakewalk Inc.
Base 57
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 18:34:26 (permalink)
"We asked around"
 
I clicked that link. The depth of my ignorance continues to be  unmeasurable. I thought Steam was a content delivery platform for games (something that I don't want on my DAW). I had no idea that it was also yet another social media platform that we all must follow to stay informed.
 
FWIW If you had posted that same letter on this forum also, you would likely have had to call most if not all of us.
As far as the anonymity of the forum; we may be anonymous to each other, but you guys know who we are.
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 18:47:39 (permalink)
Base 57
I had no idea that it was also yet another social media platform that we all must follow to stay informed.

 
As I mentioned in a previous post. If you don't have SONAR on Steam, the benefit of following it will be negligible and may seed confusion for direct users.
 
Base 57FWIW If you had posted that same letter on this forum also, you would likely have had to call most if not all of us.

 
We wouldn't have posted the same message here. A direct user replying to that Steam post would not have had a follow up call, since it wasn't the goal of the interview process and would have ultimately skewed our data set.
 
Base 57As far as the anonymity of the forum; we may be anonymous to each other, but you guys know who we are.



No, that's not true. Anyone can register an account with a fake name and use a proxy to bypass bans.

Best,

Seth Kellogg 
STEAM Community Manager & LiveOps 
Quality Assurance Engineer
Cakewalk Inc.
Base 57
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/22 19:45:34 (permalink)
488,666...
 
Nevermind. I'm going back across the corridor for the "Getting Hit Over the Head Lessons".
Brian Walton
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/23 21:43:21 (permalink)
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
 
 
Brian WaltonCurious where the pool of customer interviews came from.

 
Internal analytics and we asked around.
 


Ahhh...that explains a lot.  Polling the Steam user base can't possibly be representative of the entire user base.  
 
I'd be absolutely shocked if even 1/4 of the people that bought Sonar got it through Steam...
 
Of course not sure about your internal analytics component. 
Blades
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/25 13:57:55 (permalink)
Just a quick post to shout out to Seth for supporting me "outside of the normal support system".  While I think it's unfortunate that the way that I got support was by stomping my feet on the forum (knowing that I submitted a bug report - but not realizing that no one would ever necessarily address it without reporting that I reported it), I appreciate that Seth came to me via PM on the forum, where support "is not supposed to happen" and has gotten both of my issues at least looked at by the development team and hopefully on to being fixed.
 
So - thanks Seth!

Blades
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MrFun61
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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/27 00:27:02 (permalink)
I sure am glad I got on the lifetime update train during the promotion period :-)
michael japan
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posted by accident-disregard 2017/03/29 03:48:19 (permalink)
posted by accident-disregard
post edited by michael japan - 2017/03/29 04:49:30

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Re: Cakewalk Announces Simpler SONAR Prices 2017/03/29 20:21:05 (permalink)
I bought Platinum in Feb 2015. After one year, I bought another 12 month's worth of upgrades. In Feb 2017, the thing has expired. Clicking on the links in Cakewalk.com, it says my membership ended on 19 Feb 2017. Does this mean I have to lay out another $499 to stay current? If not, please provide a link to point me in the right direction.
 
EDIT: Nevermind, I found it. $199 for another year. Ouch!

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