Helpful ReplyLockedHave Tried to Be Patient...

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holderofthehorns
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/23 20:03:06 (permalink)
I speed read this forum. Very quickly.
Then I go to other forums where they talk about music and recording.

Nothing personal to anyone here. This is a good place.
I just want to read about music and recording. That's all.

So, it's off to Techniques (and some other places).

See you in a week or so.

Eric Anderson
HolderOfTheHorns - It's a Viking thing.
#31
John
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/23 20:07:02 (permalink)
Am I missing something here??? Why, oh why, do inane threads like this continue to garner responses when there are newbies (like me) that REALLY need help and might get a handful of responses at best? If he wants to leave the forum, let him go! I too value ALL the help I have gotten here. The thing is though, if people just ignored the threads that bothered them, the threads would fizzle out. Why contribute to the idiotic vents, trolls, and taunters? (OK, I am guilty of doing this just by posting here also but, you get my drift right?) There are 4 pages of responses to a stupid thread about the best rock and roll band in a America. Huh??? This forum is about answering questions about Sonar isn't it? I will hope in the future the 'mature" members here will stop contributing to inane threads and put their immense talent and knowledge into helping idiots like me make headway in their journey with Sonar.
Thanks for letting me vent,
Ron


Sorry I am not jumping on your question in your thread and helping you out. Maybe I don't want to. Maybe I want to discus this thread. Or maybe I think I did help someone already and am looking for other threads to answer. Or perhaps I am concerned about Papa.

Take you own advice and ignore this thread if you like. Remember one fundamental thing I don't get paid to do anything here so I am not at your beck and call.

Edited so it would be more clear as to whom it is meant for.
post edited by John - 2008/03/24 00:30:02

Best
John
#32
SongCraft
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/23 23:37:31 (permalink)
ORIGINAL: John

Happy Birthday Song. Have a good one on me.


Nice post BTW.

Thanks John

I'm having a fantastic day! In fact this year is going great :)

Got a new LCD monitor and a very nice large executive style desk, it's the perfect size for my studio.

 
 
#33
SongCraft
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/23 23:53:25 (permalink)
ORIGINAL: DaneStewart

Anonymity is one of THE worst contributors to forum abuse. Zero accountability brings out the WORST in human nature.
If every member were required to register and post using their REAL NAME the garbage behavior would drop RADICALLY. (Jaron Lanier wrote a great article about this and other bad behavior on the internet. It was published in Discover Magazine last year.)

Maybe a new forum with this as a requirement would gain in popularity.
I would want to join it anyway. Right now.

~Dane Stewart
(My real name!)


Hi Dane

I agree with you, however! Let these anonymous users who abuse the law think they're safe because it's a false comfort to them! Fact is, we all leave footprints in the form of IP (unique ID number) where police can easily trace offenders regardless if their using a proxy. My website/forum database is loaded with reports (auto-logs) I've been running forums long enough to know what I'm talking about and have in the past sent reports to the police.

The reason why most users prefer not to use their real name (especially their full name) is for privacy reasons and also for security reasons regarding identity thief and risk to online scams.

.

 
 
#34
John
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 00:20:10 (permalink)
The reason why most users prefer not to use their real name (especially their full name) is for privacy reasons and also for security reasons regarding identity thief and risk to online scams.

It goes further then that. There are way too many crazy people out and about. It is only prudent not to let the whole world know all about you. Giving a full name will allow them to do all sorts of nasty things to you. Too much knowledge is a dangerous thing. LOL

Best
John
#35
SongCraft
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 00:33:50 (permalink)
ORIGINAL: John

The reason why most users prefer not to use their real name (especially their full name) is for privacy reasons and also for security reasons regarding identity thief and risk to online scams.

It goes further then that. There are way too many crazy people out and about. It is only prudent not to let the whole world know all about you. Giving a full name will allow them to do all sorts of nasty things to you. Too much knowledge is a dangerous thing. LOL

Yes! Those reasons too, and for many reasons which can be life threatening!

Take care!

 
 
#36
robby
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 00:51:40 (permalink)
Songcraft, you are the man, and "a man". I wish some of the whiners were more like you...

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#37
DaneStewart
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 02:31:14 (permalink)
Songcraft and robby,

You do make good points. I guess I didn't think about it in those terms.
Thinking honestly can make one a bit of an outsider these days......

People can be nasty little monkeys....

Your advice is well taken.

Cheers to you.

To thine own self be true. ~TheDane
#38
Positively Charged
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 03:38:37 (permalink)
Somebody mentioned anonymity. I want to say that not everybody who wants (or in my case, needs) to be anonymous has some malicious or nefarious plan.

I wish to remain anonymous for my own safety, having been threatened and stalked in the past (online by a stranger once, and offline by somebody with an obsessive interest).

I also have somewhat legal/copyright reasons for keeping mum about certain details. Not really a big deal, and maybe I am making it to be more than it really is. But I have to be cautious, just for my own peace of mind, and if it's safer for me this way, well that's fine too. There's already too many people in the world that are "letting it all hang out."

I know Papa was offended by my obliqueness, and made some terse comments to me and to another couple of other new entrants here. At first, I thought he was one of the short-tempered and/or mean ones, and I nearly used the "ignore" feature on him!

But then I decided to just give it time and see if he was a good guy. Too bad he's gone. But life goes on, and I have a lot to learn about Sonar!
#39
mtech
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 04:17:54 (permalink)
There are 4 pages of responses to a stupid thread about the best rock and roll band in a America. Huh??? This forum is about answering questions about Sonar isn't it? I will hope in the future the 'mature" members here will stop contributing to inane threads and put their immense talent and knowledge into helping idiots like me make headway in their journey with Sonar.

I Agree with you Ron, there was a thread recently like "I Love my Dog" and that went to 2 Pages, there's sometimes so much drivel around here that you cant ignore the perps, as you would have to put most of the Users on your Ignore list. I Don't blame Papa for leaving either, although I haven't read the thread I can just imagine. The Other Problem is that if someone does tell a poster that they are off topic , you get flamed for telling him and all the Users tell you to chill out or ignore it. We come here for information, either giving or receiving not chatting about aour Dogs, Families, Hobbies etc
#40
Positively Charged
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 12:06:14 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: mtech

The Other Problem is that if someone does tell a poster that they are off topic , you get flamed for telling him and all the Users tell you to chill out or ignore it.


Or they accuse you of being a self-appointed forum cop...

We come here for information, either giving or receiving not chatting about aour Dogs, Families, Hobbies etc


Not everybody is here for the same thing. I understand that, and I can live with that. I would prefer off topic things be few, and be properly tagged in the subject line as [OT]... or "O.T." or "Off Topic", or something rather obvious that will tell me that it's okay to not open it...
#41
stratcat33511
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 12:11:07 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: papa2004

but...Too many are abusing these forums while contributing nothing to them. See y'all later!


Exile Forever !
#42
kwgm
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 13:26:55 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: John

It would really help if you were to tell us just what thread you had in mind. Being vague isn't helping matters much.


John,

I'm sorry, but I honestly don't recall which thread. I wasn't looking for anything in particular at the time, and you know how it is here -- you scan the new subject-lines to find an interesting topic and start to read. And as I've already said, I'm not certain that particular thread was the "last straw" that sent him away, but I understand why it may have been.

There is a way here to find posts by username and if you're interested, you might search on his name and read the last few threads in which he participated.


--kwgm
#43
Black Pug Studios
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 13:56:37 (permalink)
I, for one, would like to wish Papa well! I respect his decision and also understand. We had a small family here........... and now the masses have proved their worth again. There is a reason the masses are ashes! It seems to me the people that are not concerned about Papa are the ones that havn't been here for a while. Lack of respect! One of the biggest problems of the world! Selfishness the other! Listen to some.......... "forget Papa, I'm here to get my stupid question answered...... and then trash you"! Pretty soon, there will be no knowledgable people here to answer questions. Go figure. I wonder how CJ's abrupt handling of some newb's is perceived now, and in the future. How's that Cakewalk by Roland thing going for everyone?
#44
Stevie B
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 14:12:43 (permalink)
Theres one in every Bar!
#45
papa2004
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 16:25:57 (permalink)
http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.asp?m=1340879

Not the sole reason, but one of many. This forum should not be a stepping stone to "how do I make it work?". Making it "work" requires a little effort and homework on the part of those who think Sonar is going to make them a "star". Why anyone in their right mind would spend $600 on software when they have no idea how to begin using it is beyond me.

I'm old & I'm tired. I'm no longer willing to google your soundcard's spec's and give you a detailed reason why the basic tasks of Sonar (or any other DAW) aren't working for you.

I'm tired of all the bickering and insults, and I'm tired of the ridiculous ramblings that are supposed to be of some help. I don't mind OT threads, but I do have a problem with threads that are titled "What Is The Best...?" That serves no purpose! It's an opinion, but it doesn't mean it's right!

The trolls and pirates have taken a toll on these forums. Now is the time for CW to step in and start cleaning things up.

Regards,
Papa
#46
Dave Modisette
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 16:31:55 (permalink)
I've simply set up house in the General forum. Lot's more room to move around in there. I check in here maybe once a day, have a quick look at the headers and then leave.

Dave Modisette ... rocks a Purrrfect Audio Studio Pro rig.

http://www.gatortraks.com 
My music.
... And of course, the Facebook page. 
#47
Black Pug Studios
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 16:38:33 (permalink)
I couldn't agree more. It's surprising when someone gets offended to "try the tutorials". After I tried the tutorials and such, I was ready to ask some real questions.
#48
Stevie B
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 16:46:52 (permalink)
I feel your pain there are always going to be someone out there that is just there to give people jab talk. This forum was created for us to help those who need help not Jabs! Stay with us some of us really care!
#49
SteveJL
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 17:05:15 (permalink)
Just don't feel you have to leave the place completely Papa. Maybe try not to take things personally, budget your time and energy spent here, and continue to be a force of goodwill, even to those who don't seem to deserve it.

 
#50
Tom F
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 17:46:19 (permalink)
what i dont understand is why a lot of folks have always to bring this "family" thing here..i know that there are a lot of negative people here but all this complaining about "the good old times" here is a bit cheesy...whats up with you - looks like you wanna get an award for politness or conservativity - take a look at the rest of life - its a big dirty mess out there - there is more offensive, vulgar and violent content almost everywhere then here...so if you wanna retire from the forum just do it - someone else will take your place...and i dont want to offend anyone, by saying this - its just the way it is...some people here from the "old guard" here have a rather naive aproach - do you expect someone to respect you because you helped others before or just because you have been posting since whenever and you have 10000 posts? what does that mean ? actually just that you have plenty of time to waste...not that you are holy....
if you feel to help do it - if you are sick and tired then let it be - or you could also ignore the fllamers - why do you take all so personal?
this is just a forum not a billionair charity event - you got all sort of people here - and personally i am starting to get more turned off by all the "Goody Two Shoes" guys than by the easy going ones....you are at least as much wasting the time of those who just care about infos than the trolls...i even prefere a guy insulting me instead of one who starts to preach his personal values on a musician forum...
this is no computergame where you gain levels for doing things (as the stars might suggest) this is just a very small virtual extract of what an open discussion in a (probably) pub would generate....
i know its a bit cynical - but in a certain way the good ones and the bad ones are very similar - off topic - pathetic - agressive....
i read the thread of batman and today i have an other conclusion than yesterday...it was the "good" guys flaming him because of his name - and he didnt wanna accept it just because he is a "newbie"...and there you go -- with the old moralizeres telling him a lot of very subjective stuff...

i would handle it like this - answer or not - but dont make whining threads about you forum life going down the drain....its your choice to read all those things - and as long there is freedom of speech ... well ... whatever...

maybe papa could rethink his decision because surely he is a good person - but dont expect to many people crying for his leaving...and since i like writing in this forum i posted my opinion - if many wont share it - thats pretty ok - i will turn off the laptop and feel fresh tomorrow - because fortunately my emotions are more involved in real life things than here

cheers
#51
robby
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 18:20:24 (permalink)
POW! Right in the kisser!

==================
It is better to travel well than to arrive.

www.reverbnation.com/rockinrobby
#52
John
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 18:23:38 (permalink)
Conservativity theorem
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In mathematical logic, the conservativity theorem states the following: Suppose that a closed formula


is a theorem of a first-order theory T. Let T1 be a theory obtained from T by extending its language with new constants


and adding a new axiom
.

Then T1 is a conservative extension of T, which means that the theory T1 has the same set of theorems in the original language (i.e., without constants ) as the theory T.

In a more general setting, the conservativity theorem is formulated for extensions of a first-order theory by introducing a new functional symbol:
Suppose that a closed formula is a theorem of a first-order theory T, where we denote . Let T1 be a theory obtained from T by extending its language with new functional symbol (of arity n) and adding a new axiom . Then T1 is a conservative extension of T, i.e. the theories T and T1 prove the same theorems not involving the functional symbol ).

Best
John
#53
Tom F
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 18:36:24 (permalink)
yeah i studied technical mathematics for a year and then retired because it was really heavy :-) but john you know i wasnt talking about maths here ....

cheers
#54
Tom F
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 18:53:06 (permalink)
ok it should be "Conservatism" but i think that for a non english guy i can express myself pretty well in this language...

we could also talk in grman or italian if you prefere :-)

cheers
#55
Fog
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 19:04:59 (permalink)
ORIGINAL: papa2004

but...Too many are abusing these forums while contributing nothing to them. See y'all later!


happens on ALL forums I've been on, and not just coz I'm a member of them . Can anyone honestly say they have been on a forum and the content has be 100% or even 90% on point? (if so.. tell me..hehe)

It's a bit like some websites I have used, if your intially one of the original people it's good, and all the masses DON'T know about it. When that changes, it's not so fun to be there. Even the internet was like that, if you used it say in 1994 etc.. it was mainly academics using it, as it grew , so did the amount of muppets and finding exactly what you wanted that was relevant did get a bit trickier (too many adverts etc)

just take it with a pinch of salt, if it becomes personal, thats different. Come and go as ya want, sometimes a break is good.
#56
SongCraft
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 20:23:41 (permalink)
ORIGINAL: papa2004

http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.asp?m=1340879

Not the sole reason, but one of many. This forum should not be a stepping stone to "how do I make it work?". Making it "work" requires a little effort and homework on the part of those who think Sonar is going to make them a "star". Why anyone in their right mind would spend $600 on software when they have no idea how to begin using it is beyond me.

I'm old & I'm tired. I'm no longer willing to google your soundcard's spec's and give you a detailed reason why the basic tasks of Sonar (or any other DAW) aren't working for you.

I'm tired of all the bickering and insults, and I'm tired of the ridiculous ramblings that are supposed to be of some help. I don't mind OT threads, but I do have a problem with threads that are titled "What Is The Best...?" That serves no purpose! It's an opinion, but it doesn't mean it's right!

The trolls and pirates have taken a toll on these forums. Now is the time for CW to step in and start cleaning things up.

Hi Papa2004

Good to see you :)

I can totally relate and understand what you're saying! I know the importance of having a good search function and at times it does go off-line (fails). Also, I agree this is suppose to be a technical support forum and sadly I have noticed this site is being taken over by Trolls, (troublemakers) and I suspect a lot of members here are using pirated software. I have already reported incidents to Cakewalk and I ask you, John and others to support my goal to weed out the Trolls and pirate software users.

Thanks!

.

 
 
#57
mwd
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 21:11:16 (permalink)
With all respect many people mistake this for a tech support forum and that's where some problems begin thinking we've been robbed of Sonar education because someone mentions their family or their dog.

Take a look at a dictionary definition of 'forum'
1. a public meeting or assembly for open discussion
2. a public facility to meet for open discussion

The title of this particular forum is 'SONAR Producer and Studio - Discussion focused on the use of SONAR Producer and Studio editions. It doesn't say "limited to" it says "focused on".

It's pretty dang clear on Cakewalks Main Page that this isn't intended to be a Tech Support forum because the 'Forum' link ain't under the 'Support' link.

So while the 'best rock band in America' or even Papa2004's thread about leaving might be better in another category it does not mean they do not have a place here.

The only problems I see are that this forum is short of moderators to keep out the riff raff and move topics to the appropriate category.

And while many may see this as a support forum there are those that see it as a place for musicians to meet and talk who share a common denominator... they use Cakewalk.



#58
John
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 22:30:39 (permalink)
We could talk in Venusian too. It would be just as senseless. I speak American English and only that passably.

I am sorry that you are the one that is going be singled out for the following rant. You were in the wrong place at the wrong time and said the wrong thing.


some people here from the "old guard" here have a rather naive approach - do you expect someone to respect you because you helped others before or just because you have been posting since whenever and you have 10000 posts? what does that mean ? actually just that you have plenty of time to waste...not that you are holy....

Check my join date. I came here when it started. I was in the old Newsgroup before that.

This may have no meaning to you but it has to me. I have seen many come and go. I am still here. Still standing. I have a body of work that I am proud of. I have based my postings on quality and accuracy.
I have striven to contribute to this forum the best possible information I can. I have answered countless posts. Given lots of advice. Advice that I believe is the best I could muster. I have done the best that I could for a very long time. You look at that and belittle it. You stand there and bemoan the fact I have been doing this for years. To you that is meaningless and has no value.

You who joined last year find fault with me for doing my best to contribute as much as I can so you could come in here and do a search and find a post I may have answered. Did it help you with your issue?

You may think it is just fine to belittle what I have given over the years. You may feel that we are all equal here. In a way we are but if ones work means anything at all then that can't be completely true.
I don't ask for anything. I don't want you to have any particular view on me or any other long term member except I ask you to not attack us for holding the fort all these years so you could waltz in and insult us for doing so.

I am getting very tired of the new people feeling it is just fine to belittle the work and time the older members have put in.

We welcome all of you. We thrive on new members. This forum would die if it were not for a constant renewal of the membership. That in no way gives the new members the right to bash, attack or otherwise take liberties with anyone here. To bash those that have been here giving of themselves for a very long time seems both ungrateful and shortsighted.

It is fine to have an objection to a post I may make. It is fine to correct it if needed. I welcome correction. To me the worst thing that can be done is give incorrect information. I count on the entire forum to double check all posts for accuracy. What is not acceptable is finding fault for a view point.
Attacking to cause trouble. None of which is beneficial to the forum or to good order.

I have been enjoying most of your posts. As a rule you seem to be on top of things. Now we have come to logger heads and I a sorry you have to be the one that is getting this post. It really is not meant to you alone it is meant to all those that seem intent on spoiling the record of very dedicated members.




Best
John
#59
robby
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RE: Have Tried to Be Patient... 2008/03/24 22:38:36 (permalink)
POW! Right in the kisser!

==================
It is better to travel well than to arrive.

www.reverbnation.com/rockinrobby
#60
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