Sonar crashes yet again - So far so good ( was 'Trying to solve it' & 'Time to drop it')

I have been where you are and understand your frustration.

But still, it usually has to do with certain drivers or plugins.

A computer is complex net of software working together(or is supposed to) and some info about soundcard primarily would be helpful, to us and to Cakewalk to get a grip on the problem.

Testing numerous firewire interfaces I had blue screen even when using a certain brand and using wdm-drivers and activating echo on one input channel. But it worked fine in Reaper. But it worked in Sonar too with ASIO.

So there may be a particular driver that is involved in your problem. I do believe that.

So please give us some background on your system.

In a stable Windows environment (is that actually possible?), Sonar is fine... full stop.

Evidence is here in my humble studio and that of thousands of others.

Hope you get it sorted before you load up your next solution and is it a genuine copy you are installing? Nothing implied, but it is a genuine issue.

Cheers.

Goseba


I've listed my specs before and nothing came of it. I seriously think this time was the last for me with Sonar. I have had my fill of uninstalling and reinstalling it again and again.

There's an old saying:  "If it's not working for you - move on".
 
Perhaps that would be best for you.  And if you do, I wish you great success.
 
 

Goseba


First, yes I am a legitimate registered owner.

I only have a couple of hours a week, if I am lucky, for music. I can't afford to spend this time problem solving almost every other time I use Sonar.

I am not looking to start a host debate, but I am going to give Reaper it's chance. At least Reaper will install in a minute - Sonar is a fair bit more time consuming than that.

It does hurt to move on because I do like Sonar. It also hurts that I spent good money on it and have had more problems than good from it - and I can't even sell it.

You can say it's not Sonar, it's my set up but why then does other software not crash like Sonar? Maybe there is something in my setup Sonar doesn't like, maybe Sonar just isn't up to the job. Who knows, I just know I don't have time to keep trying to solve it's problems.

Goseba,
 
Don't think I don't feel your pain.  Let me tell you a story....
 
A few years back - around Sonar 3.x -- I was running REALLLLLY smooth.  Loving it.  Then CW release version 3.4b I think it was (version isn't important) -- and all of a sudden - CRASH CITY.
 
I went beserk.  My smooth system turned into mooosh.  It was so disheartening, so discouraging.   So I came online and lambasted the product and its beta testers.    I was filled with angst.
 
One of the developers came online and suggested I needed to update my audio drivers because, yes, Sonar made a change - for the better.   And I thought - WTF?  They make a change and my whole musical life goes into the toilet???
 
Well, he was right though.  Just like we now have 64bit OS (Windows 7) and "things have changed" -- a company like CW has to stay "up to date".   So, about a few days later there was an update to my audio device driver -- and sure enough - everything went back to smooth again!   What a relief!
 
So the point is... and I say this again:  probably whatever it is you're going through can be fixed (subject to a few variables of course).
 
Go ahead and try Reaper.  I did.  Not my cup of tea, even though there are some nice things they do (hopefully Sonar will 'borrow' them lol).   But, instead of giving up on Sonar so quickly - WORK IT THROUGH. 
 
Try, with some of our help (ie, us users), to dig in and find what it is that is causing you (unlike MANY thousands others) to have problems.   I bet you there is a solution.
 
Whether it costs money or not, I don't know.  But if you are not using an "internal" cheapo sound card then I bet there are solutions.   If you ARE using a cheapo sound card, then you get what you pay for, as they say.  Don't expect miracles.
 
Sonar does do things a bit different than Reaper and some others.   They are newer, and have the advantage of learning from mistakes of the past.  But they are also not as mature.  And therefor, what you THINK you're getting may not be all you think it is.
 
Regardless -- I just think it's too easy to shrug things off in this case.  YES, sorry to say - I DO think it is your setup, your hardware, your drivers.   SOMETHING is screwing you up.  And I feel for you.  Seriously.
 
But if you approach it like a child who runs when he/she can't get their candy, then that's how you will approach everything elese.  
 
Digital Hosts such as Sonar ARE complex.  So take it as a challenge to get this working.  You will end up learning tons, and you won't be sucker-punched by marketing hype of the others.
 
Sure, there are other good hosts.  But you already have an investment and somewhat familiar with Sonar.  "Work it through".  
 
At least consider this.   And should decide to move, I wish you well.   But I suspect when you encounter problems with any other host, it's your mindset that will trap you, not the solutions that may exist.
 
I wish you well, regardless of your decision.
 
 

I've had a fair number of hosts over the years, starting with Pro24 on the Atari in the early 90's, then I had (a positive) experience Pro Audio 9 when i did music with a friend, Cubasis, Orion, Live 3-7, Project 5 and have toyed with Reaper on and off for a couple of years. None have had the amount of problems I have with Sonar, not even Live.

It most certainly is something it doesn't like with my system, but it has been unique in that, other hosts have been fine on this pc.

I had issues with v-vocal too and I know I am not alone there.

My last thread with an issue was only a couple of weeks ago when I had the same problem as now. I had to completely uninstall and reinstall. It fixed it briefly but now the problem is back.

As I have already said, I have very little time for music - I want to spend that time making music, not getting frustrated sorting out software issues.  Other software works right straight out of the box and that is what I need.

I have/have had, other hosts and they ran just fine on this PC. IT IS only Sonar that I have had isses with. 

FWIW.
Win XP SP3, C2D 2.2Ghz, 2Gb RAM, M-Audio 2496.

Today I opened a project, exported some audio. Exited Sonar for a while when I was away from the pc, then when I tried to start Sonar again it just crashed on start. Not the first time I have had this issue.

Latest drivers and no IRQ conflicts. Motherboard only takes 2GB so no chance to increase that.
Single H/Drive, 7200rpm, I cannot afford a second at this time.
The PC exceeds the minimum requirements.

Internet access for authorisations and Comodo AV and firewall.

As I've said before, other hosts have had no problems. I don't see why I should have to deal with all this hassle.

I actually just bought Cubase .... so perhaps some of the fanboys will be rid of me soon!

Why? Well I've recently gone full-time pro with this thing, and with that, stability and consistency have suddenly risen to the very top of my list - well above "what I'm used to" or any particular features.

Interestingly ... SONAR 8.5.3 has been pretty darn stable for me - best SONAR yet for me to tell the truth, but still ... well .... in a phrase .... I don't trust it. Couple stories ...

I was doing some automation on a fairly simple song 15-20 tracks, and had a string section level-automated just perfect with some fairly dramatic moves. All of a sudden for no reason, on playback, fader no longer moving, automation not working, and client says "Aren't the strings supposed to come in there?" Envelope was there, read was on, everything should work. I messed with it for awhile, and I ended up having to clone track, ditch original, and then it worked again. Later learned on this forum that "sometimes this happens" and "just restart SONAR" when it does. It's that kind of crap that I can't have ... at all, zero, ever, period ... was embarrassing in front of client.

My first live recording with my new business - symphony orchestra  - we take an older, low powered Mac iBook out with a traveler interface, a pre, and MOTU Digital Performer 4.something - several years old - record a 2 hour + concert straight through - no probs whatsoever. The whole time I was thinking, man ... if this was SONAR, it could easily just stop or crash or do something funky at any time along the way. Not that I have that happen much ... but it does happen every so often.  For example, I was recording a lady singing one day, went along fine for quite awhile, then suddenly, in the middle of a take - SONAR just stops! - audio engine drop-out ... no reason whatsoever! ... ran it again and fine rest of the day. In the studio, no big deal necessarily .. "hey let's do that verse over" .. live ... it would be disastrous!

Also - I'm just tired of accepting "work arounds" that I have to do to "baby" SONAR. There's a lot of noise on this forum about getting your system, and drivers, etc. etc. etc. right and that being most people's problems ... but you know what? I've got a pretty high powered system, stay on top of drivers and updates, and I just don't have these problems with my other audio software! SONAR .. how can I say it ... is just too sensitive to things perhaps ... not robust enough ... doesn't seem "industrial strength". You shouldn't have to treat it with kid gloves all the time, and I feel like I do. Another example - I've given up trying to import lower sample rate files into a project and have it up-sample into SONAR - seems like if I do more than 1 or 2 tracks at once, it ALWAYS crashes. I've gone to rate conversion in Wavelab and then import into SONAR ... another work-around ... sigh ....

I know Cubase (and any DAW) will have it's flaws and quirks, but I'm hoping and expecting that they won't be in the stability department or with basic features like automation or import. FLAWLESS tracking is a requirement. I also expect it to play much better with my RME interface. Perhaps I'm wrong on Cubase, and it will be no better. I'll come back here and post that loud and clear if that happens. But I'm looking forward to being able to trust my primary tool.

SWANG

you should use tape. 

LOL! Yeah! Actually - I still use a DAT machine sometimes for back-up on live recordings. I trust it more than ANY DAW!

I actually just bought Cubase .... so perhaps some of the fanboys will be rid of me soon! Why? Well I've recently gone full-time pro with this thing, and with that, stability and consistency have suddenly risen to the very top of my list - well above "what I'm used to" or any particular features. Interestingly ... SONAR 8.5.3 has been pretty darn stable for me - best SONAR yet for me to tell the truth, but still ... well .... in a phrase .... I don't trust it. Couple stories ...

 
While not trying to get into the host wars, I do think it's somewhat strange when people suggest that this or that other host will be - in the long run -any better or worse.
 
It's all software.  And, hosts - in particular- have to host 3rd party plugins.  There's just too many variables.   Until and unless someone invents a way to prevent EVERY piece of software from crashing - or crashing another piece of software, I just don't see how anyone can honestly think there's some type of software nirvana out there.
 
And, more often than not it seems those making a change (whether from Sonar or from another host TO Sonar) have not spent as much time in their new host to know what to expect, or how stable/reliable it will or won't be.
 
IOW - if you've spent years of doing work in Sonar, using many various plugins, trying new things, etc -- and then try a new host for a week -- I just doubt that one week will reveal or expose all the potential problems the new host may have.
 
IF someone had spent the same amount of time doing the same types of work in more than one host, then I could understand a statement about its stability or lack thereof - based on the same experience/time spent, etc.
 
From all I gather, every host ... Sonar, Cubase, Reaper, Live, Logic, ad infinitum -- all have their fair set of issues.  Software simply is imperfect (kinda like us humans).
 
But, as they say ... The grass always looks greener on the other side.
 
ANd - a note about "Fanboys".    What the heck is wrong with someone advocating, albeit strongly, for their host of chioice -- especially IN the forums for that host?!  
 
I don't consider myself a fanboy, but I certainly see nothing wrong in being one IF it's based on honest experience and fairness of position.
 
 

ANd - a note about "Fanboys". What the heck is wrong with someone advocating, albeit strongly, for their host of chioice -- especially IN the forums for that host?!

This is only a way to stifle real discussion. I am glad you take issue with that pejorative word. Its insulting and an ad hominen attack. The resort of the intellectually challenged.

BTW the rest of you post Billy is excellent as well.

 

John

ANd - a note about "Fanboys". What the heck is wrong with someone advocating, albeit strongly, for their host of chioice -- especially IN the forums for that host?!

This is only a way to stifle real discussion. I am glad you take issue with that pejorative word. Its insulting and an ad hominen attack. The resort of the intellectually challenged.

BTW the rest of you post Billy is excellent as well.

 

Thanks John.  And, while I wouldn't go so far to say someone is intellectually challenged when they use the 'fanboy' argument, but I agree it does stifle discussion in general.

It is not always a driver or software problem.

Correct. It's usually a hardware problem that is the direct cause of software failure. If programs in the system degrade in functionality, then that's usually the first sign that your ram is bad. I know because I went through the same thing. With bad ram, the hard drive is actually overwriting data that already exists on the system, and then things get worse, and worse, and worse...

Fanboy?  "one who blindly and venomously advocates for their tool of choice, ignoring it's faults (or blaming them on the user, the system, etc.), while belittling or dismissing competitive products that they actually know little about and have likely never used".

I think it describes quite a few here.

BTW - it took me fifteen minutes on a five year old version of DP to find several things about it that were better than SONAR. I also saw several things SONAR did better. The "fanboy" will dismiss the former as irrelevant while playing up the latter.

Like I said - I'll report back on Cubase after having used it for awhile. If it has the same stability or other issues - I'll admit it freely and point them out. I actually wish to heck I didn't have to try another DAW - it costs $ and a big learning curve, plus I like a lot of things about SONAR. But I must have something that has pro-level stability for ME, and SONAR is not it right now.