Beepster

Dave__lol
Really! you don't even have all the bugs out of X3!!! and now you want to start a "paid subscription DAW" to replace everything! lol!
Lets talk..... I say "CLASS ACTION SUIT!" you sold me X3e and it does NOT work. off the top of my head, channel strip eq will only work with preset. VST loader loads differently on its own and random plugins don't even show up... Even the ones that came with X3! lol.... CRASH! CRASH! CRASH! I have had to reinstall X3 many times because magically plugins become installed wrong!, Freeze track doubles the tracks...   
 
I've ben using Cakewalk since it was 12tone over 20 years and this is upgrade (lol) if you want to call it that is the last straw for me! HELLO ProTools!
BTW... and if you can't  FIX X3, I want my money back! it's crap and you don't stand behind ANYTHING you have crate!

Yeah... I had the same problems when I tried to install X3 on my Speak and Spell.
 
For some reason it works great on my semi modern PC tho.

I'm on a new PC system...

Dave__lol
lost my password and user name... lol, I don't have much use in hanging out on forums to feel important, needed and wanted. ;) 

Well, maybe someone here can help you get X3 straightened out on your system. Best of luck to you.

Hm, not sure I like this either.  I guess I've been used to getting the $99.00 upgrades when offered, so this in effect is now going to cost me 50% more than what I'm used to paying.  It's probably more fair, but still...
 
I guess this is the end of sales and discounts on the actual DAW, is that right?
 
Also, very disappointed in the feature set even released so far.  The only thing remotely that seems of interest to me is the Audiosnap additions, but from what I see now (and maybe there's more, forgive me if I'm wrong), it doesn't look like much has really been added or changed.  There's better detection, I get that, but I didn't see any more options on online or off-line algorithms.  I would have really like to have a much better real-time algorithm.
 
Also, tbh, what I have seen (so far) in the initial release is a lot of cosmetic or small features, and not stuff that really gets my blood pumping.  A better looking piano keyboard in the PRV and stacked controls might be nice, but for me much better Audiosnap enhancements, auto slice to drum/sample machine, and fully nestable tracks, or (gasp!) even a Mac version would make it much more likely for me to pony up the monthly or yearly costs.
 
So, for now, I'm going to sit on the sidelines and see how this grand experiment shakes out.  It will be interesting to see if other DAW providers try it.

Are sonitus plugins still there in platinum?

So, no more simply downloading the uprade? Sorry to be a naysayer, but I don't see an upside to renting software on the customer end.
 
Maybe I'm seeing it wrong, but when you purchase software you can continue using it until the OS will no longer support it. Pay a premium price to rent it and once your subscription is up you are forced to renew and can longer use it until you do?
 
Is that correct?

Placed my order....$25 discount!  Oh yeah baby!

Let the anticipation begin!

Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]

TabSel
Not knowing the new EULA is indeed the reason why I am asking this question ;)

So, Ryan, as you are already on it, any details, please, on how bug fixing/repairs/warranty periods/refunds are handled within this new licensing model?

I'm probably the wrong person to ask legal questions to, and actually on my phone and don't have access to the new EULA. You might be picking on the wrong guy ;)

However, I will say your examples seem like the exact reason we spent the last few years building the foundation for this new model. I think you'll find that not only will bug fixes and excellent new features be delivered in a better and more consistent way, but also that legal binding documents aside, Cakewalk has a long standing history of taking care of its customers. The types of scenarios you are explaining are ones where we often resort to thinking how people think versus how contracts read. There is always gray area and we have made exceptions to the rule many times in the past when things were reasonable. Maybe its our downfall, but I think you'll find Cakewalk is employed by humans and not robots. From what I understand, Gibson also has an extremely firm philosophy of taking care of its customers as well. Anyhow, it's up to us to convince people whether or not to sticking to the plan is worth it.

I'll let the EULA speak for itself when its available, but I felt the need to remind everyone that Cakewalk is an extremely reasonable company to work for and with.

No doubt about that, thanks for your post.
But please understand that I'm pretty unsure on HOW this might practically be handled?
Assume just the day before my subscription ends there will be a new feature rolled out I already waited for. Two days later, already opted out, a hot fix is rolled out, that fixes a major bug in this new feature, that slipped through the test.

Now what? How's that handled? Am I entitled to the fix, or not? Do I have to create a support ticket and kindly ask for that fix, but being unable to do, as I'm no member anymore? How long does this process take me? The fix is already available, but not installed on my system, rendering the new feature I paid for with my subscription useless.
Please bear with me and explain this to me!
Is there a "bug fix process" included with your license model, or not?
Can you understand why I see lots of frustration coming?

Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]

Dave__lol
I called Cakewalk sales today... the guy picked up right way.... that's the 1st sign that this subscription DAW won't work... and the fact that he sounded "in my opinion" that I had woken him or he lives in Colorado.... ;)

I know all the guys in support. There all great guys and real people. Some of them are loud and some of them are quiet. They don't have agendas or predefined scripts. You're judging a person and making a tasteless joke that this means our new model won't work.

Well look at it this way.... how many DAWs use subscriptions as apposed to buying their DAWs? you can and will have to offer both options for it to work... Being an American as I am... this is just a cheap sales gimmick that won't fly to old or new uses. I could list the reasons why but I'm an old guy and its hard for me to breath ;) but I could ask my daughter as she is in her 3rd year of marketing at one of the top business collages to explain it better to you if you like.... 

I suggest that all new arrivals to this thread start on page one, as almost all conceivable questions have already been answered.

JoseC.
 
I've read all the thread and I do not understand what is so difficult to get. 
 
Let's say that I upgrade from X3 to Platinum now. I pay $149 upfront and I am happy for 12 months with my shiny "Sonar 2015", that gets upgrades and new features up to February 2016. 
 
Comes February 2016, and if I really do not see a reason (i.e. an upcoming new feature) to pay more at that moment, I just don't, and keep on using "Sonar 2015" until the amount of accumulated new features makes it interesting for me to pay again. Imagine that this happens February 2017. If I then buy 12 months more, I am actually paying for versions "Sonar 2016" and a full "Sonar 2017", with all its upgrades, for a fair upgrade price.
 
How is this different and/or more expensive than the current model? Now you are waiting for a new version to come out and then you decide whether its new features make you want to upgrade or not. The new model is exactly the same, but you have the advantage that you can decide when the value of that feature set is up to what you are willing to pay.
 
In the meantime, and if there is some new feature that you could need for a particular reason (or project), you can even pay a couple of months just to use that. And if you keep on paying you are even financing the next upgrade instead. 
 
I do not see what is there not to like.

Thank you for using your noodle before spewing.
 
Good thing some important people work at CW who think like you.

JohnoL
A few people have asked this general question and I have the same question.
I think the faq needs more clarification.
 

If I let my Membership expire after 12 months, can I renew it again later?

                    Yes, you can come back any time and pay the Renewal rate.
Will the renewal rate be the same after 3 months, after 6months, 1 or 2 years? 
I am talking more about paying the full 12 months in advance. Do you pay extra to "catch up?"
 
 
For the last 3 years I have gotten the new version but I usually wait 3 to 6 months when they repeat the
introductory offer and/or offer a free video with it.
 

ChazEd 
Example:
 
I pay $149 to upgrade my X3 Producer to Platinum now (January/February, 2015), the I get all Platinum current and future features for 12 months. Ok.
 
Then, in January/February, 2016, for reasons unknown (no cash, too much beer , etc), I can't renewal my Platinum Membership.
 
Then say 6 months (or 1 year, or 2 year, I don't know what will happen in the future) later I want to renewal my Platinum membership.
 
Will I have to pay full price again or just the current (2016/2017...) upgrade price?
 
Will I loose my Platinum membership and go to square one (like a new sonar user status) if I let it expire?
 

 
Sorry to quote myself again, but the faq is not clear about above situations.
 
Can someone help?

Anderton

TabSel
If you buy product that doesn't work as documented, the seller is in charge to repair/exchange/refund, of course, the buyer entitled to damages, if any.

 
That is not true. All commercial, and even most free, software has an end user license agreement (EULA). You agree to it when you install the software. Read it to find out what your rights are. I have NEVER seen software where a company assumed responsibility for consequential damages, and most software is sold "as is." Cakewalk's EULA is generally about the same as every other software company's.

That's how Microsoft covers it's ass with those Windows updates.

"you can and will have to offer both options for it to work.."
 
Buy a twelve month subscription and keep the software for free. Or alternatively buy the software and get a 12 month subscription for free. The choice is yours ;) Or alternatively pay in installments and get it 12 months later.
 
This has been answered a zillion times in this thread now...

Dave__lol

clintmartin

Bflat5
So, no more simply downloading the uprade? Sorry to be a naysayer, but I don't see an upside to renting software on the customer end.
 
Maybe I'm seeing it wrong, but when you purchase software you can continue using it until the OS will no longer support it. Pay a premium price to rent it and once your subscription is up you are forced to renew and can longer use it until you do?
 
Is that correct?

No that's not correct at all. Upgrade for $149 and it's yours forever. If you want more upgrades after a year...then you pay again.

NOPE! lol you need to look at it again... 149 for 12 months! its a subscription DAW service... You keep paying them or you have NO DAW! good luck in mid project and you have to convert ALL your projects to ProTools and have no way to do it!

Again you're wrong. I'll remind you that spreading false Information, intentionally, is trolling.

forkol
Also, tbh, what I have seen (so far) in the initial release is a lot of cosmetic or small features, and not stuff that really gets my blood pumping. 

 
I dunno. Mix Recall is extremely useful, it's a feature from the early days of automated digital consoles that I thought was never coming back. And VocalSync isn't just for dialog to picture - it's great for doubled vocals and harmonies - and the cheapest equivalent I've seen costs $140 more than the complete Platinum upgrade by itself. The customizable Control Bar is fantastic, the MIDI timing drag feature means goodbye Fit Time...I posted my first thoughts on the new features in this post. But don't forget you'll also get the new features that come out in the next 12 months, like Drum Replacement (which has already been mentioned).
 

It will be interesting to see if other DAW providers try it.

 
It puts them in a difficult position in some ways. For those who have been planning to go to a subscription/rental model, that now looks kind of selfish compared to a model that lets users keep what they buy. And if Cakewalk's model is successful, it will provide the resources needed by the company to really pour into SONAR.