Anderton

forkol
Also, tbh, what I have seen (so far) in the initial release is a lot of cosmetic or small features, and not stuff that really gets my blood pumping. 

 
I dunno. Mix Recall is extremely useful, it's a feature from the early days of automated digital consoles that I thought was never coming back. And VocalSync isn't just for dialog to picture - it's great for doubled vocals and harmonies - and the cheapest equivalent I've seen costs $140 more than the complete Platinum upgrade by itself. The customizable Control Bar is fantastic, the MIDI timing drag feature means goodbye Fit Time...I posted my first thoughts on the new features in this post. But don't forget you'll also get the new features that come out in the next 12 months, like Drum Replacement (which has already been mentioned).

 
Hey Craig, thanks for the reply.  I don't disagree with you, but it just does seem kinda small RIGHT NOW.  I mean the last go-around we got Melodyne and Addictive Drums (for some of us who really waited, we got AD2) all for the same upgrade price.
 
Also, I've already developed work-arounds for some of these that I think I'm actually going to like better anyway.  For the Vocal, if I'm doubling or harmonizing (rare in my case)  I'm probably going to use my full Melodyne OR MHamonizer.  For the mix settings, if I'm not sure, I copy a project and  save the settings.  The MIDI drag is probably useful, but a good audio drag (AKA better Audiosnap) would be more useful to me.  As for drum replacement, I do that rarely, but when I need it I go the route of either splicing audio and/or combination of Audiosnap-to-midi conversion.
 
I know these features are really useful for pro and semi-pro, but for my own home use, I can't yet justify this purchase.  That's why I am gonna wait maybe a year or so and see what the bakers can roll out.
 

forkolIt will be interesting to see if other DAW providers try it.

 

Anderton
It puts them in a difficult position in some ways. For those who have been planning to go to a subscription/rental model, that now looks kind of selfish compared to a model that lets users keep what they buy. And if Cakewalk's model is successful, it will provide the resources needed by the company to really pour into SONAR.

You are right.  Problem is, there's a lot of competition out there, and I'm starting to think there's too much, and there's gotta be a fallout coming in the DAW marketplace.  The resources that are needed to develop a world-class DAW are formidable.  I really don't see much movement in the marketplace.  You've got the big names (Pro-Tools, Cubase, Ableton, Logic) reigning supreme, then smaller developers like Bitwig, PreSonus, Sonar, FL Studio, Reaper, etc left to fight over the remaining marketplace.  I don't really see any of the smaller developers really growing their market share that much, mainly because once you have chosen your DAW, it's mighty hard to consider switching, and it will usually cost a lot to get a user to switch.  Now, I own a few other DAWS, mainly because I got them at a good price, but I can assure you that I will NOT pay multiple subscription fees for all of them at the same time. 
 
I'm just not sure if this will really be 'successful' in gaining new customers, more than it might help to even out Cakewalk's revenue stream.  The one thing that would have helped to be able to get new users, i.e. a sale, doesn't look to be an option anymore.
 

Soo dose this sonar play nicer with gaming graphics cards? If so I want in XD new features look so cool

Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]

Anderton
I'd pay $100 just for Mix Recall, it would be that useful to me. So I figure $25 for VocalSync and $25 for the new Control Bar is all I need to justify the cost, but there's all the other stuff too... 

Would like to chime in. VocalSync is a very powerful tool and there is already a similar plugin out there that is pretty much a staple in every major studio which sells for $500. So $25 is not at all even close to the value. VocalSync actually came about from discussions with professional producers who wanted an integrated vocal alignment tool in the program. While it's easy to say "just sing it right the first time," the fact is that there's always a need to align and tighten vocal parts and it's a time consuming process. This plugin is a huge time saver and a key to getting commercially sounding vocal parts. With ADR work, obviously the need is even more obvious. You need to replace dialog that was recorded poorly or with lots of ambient noise. This tool makes it easy replace that vocal. It really is a valuable production tool.

 
Well Andrew, I wasn't exactly placing a value on VocalSync   I've already mentioned several times how much the equivalent cost in the real world, but was addressing the comment about Mix Recall - I figured if I paid $100 for Mix Recall, then I was getting VocalSync for $25 and the Control Bar for $25 and there's the $150 right there. That's a pretty good deal, eh?

yevster

Anderton

yevster
And speaking of competition, with Cubase 8 pro selling in GuitarCenter and Musician's Friend for $400 with an included MIDI controller, perhaps the $499 intro price tag is counterproductive.

Well...not quite. They're selling off old stock of Cubase 7.5 for $399, with an upgrade to 8 when it comes out in February. But if someone buys SONAR in February for $499, they not only get the software that's current in February, they get updates and content for the next year culminating in the next "version" of SONAR. A more comparable analogy would be if you could buy Cubase 8 in February, and when you purchased it, get an update to Cubase 9 locked in at the same time for an extra $99, with the Cubase 9 features being downloadable as soon as they're ready.

Nope. Cubase 8 Pro has been out for a month and has already been updated to 8.05.

I know it's been out for a month; I approved their implementation of my Quadrafuzz design and received an advance copy. But what you said was "with Cubase 8 pro selling in GuitarCenter and Musician's Friend for $400" which at least according to the Guitar Center and MF sites is not true. If you enter Cubase 8 as a keyword in either site, you will not get a return. If you check for Cubase on MF, this is what you'll find, which if you click on the product says you'll get an update when it becomes available from them on February 11. The GC ad doesn't mention the update.
 
If you can produce a link to anything from MF or GC that shows they're selling Cubase 8 NOW for $400 I'll stand corrected, but I found nothing to corroborate what you said. If you want to buy Cubase 8 Pro now, the price I'm seeing is $550 from Amazon and Sweetwater. I think you may be confusing selling 7.5 for $399 with selling 8 for $400.
 
 

It's funny, but when the New Sonar was announced and I looked into it was so ready to jump........I've kinda calmed down a bit now and after reading through this thread I'm probably ready to jump off a fecking bridge :-). I'm kinda now sitting on the fence........I'm thinking do I really need the new stuff?
 
I'm a hobby muso, not a pro, but I do like having the good **** to play with. The Addictive Drums thing is, while not a deal breaker, a bit annoying since I have a lot of content that I'll still need to pay XLN an upgrade for to use in AD2. I could've upgraded AD a couple of months back for half price but decided to hang on and see what came with the new Sonar. My fault, I know. The other stuff, I'm kinda thinking I won't use enough to justify the upgrade........
 
I'm not dissing the set up, I think it's a bold step and the right way forward for Cakewalk and I might still go for it, but I might just hang on to X3 Pro. Just my 2c and where I'm at.

yevster
 
And ProChannel is one of the things with which I experienced weirdness in X3. I've had the entire chain mute itself occasionally for no reason until I restarted Sonar or disabled ProChannel. I've also had EQ parameters magically change. I know, I know. Nobody else has seen these kinds of things.

Actually people did. I think it was a known issue that was fixed. I used to have that happen sometimes, but had forgotten about it because it stopped happening after an update. I forget which one.

orhanproject
For the third time, are Sonitus plugins still there in platinum? Maybe vst versions? :)

Already answered here http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3146240

Steam users see http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3146478

Dave__lol

Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]

Dave__lol
I called Cakewalk sales today... the guy picked up right way.... that's the 1st sign that this subscription DAW won't work... and the fact that he sounded "in my opinion" that I had woken him or he lives in Colorado.... ;)

I know all the guys in support. There all great guys and real people. Some of them are loud and some of them are quiet. They don't have agendas or predefined scripts. You're judging a person and making a tasteless joke that this means our new model won't work.

Well look at it this way.... how many DAWs use subscriptions as apposed to buying their DAWs? you can and will have to offer both options for it to work... Being an American as I am... this is just a cheap sales gimmick that won't fly to old or new uses. I could list the reasons why but I'm an old guy and its hard for me to breath ;) but I could ask my daughter as she is in her 3rd year of marketing at one of the top business collages to explain it better to you if you like.... 

Reminds me of the business adage - Employ a student, whilst they still know everything...

scook

orhanproject

didnt see bifilter, is it also there? Name changed perhaps?
Saw that dimension le and rapture le is there, didnt we get the pro versions in X3 ?
Why are LE versions back?
Can someone who knows answer?

Im pretty sure I dont have le versions in x3 right now

Tone2 Bifilter2 is listed in the Boutique Suite.
The full versions of DimPro and Rapture are included in Platinum. The line items should read DimPro and Rapture with LE in the Professional Column and Pro/Full in the Platinum column. IOW, those three plug-ins will be the same in Platinum as they are in X3 Producer.

Awesome! :),i was looking on the iphone (hard to read the whole page) thanks again

CakeAlexS
1) Was asked before but just double checking. I have AD1 with X3. Will the existing packs get upgraded to AD2 free? (Then afterwards we get the additional packs we paid for with Sonar)
2) What is the the approx timespan of the introductory pricing?
3) Are drum maps fixed?
4) Anything new with Sonitus? 64 bit vst 3 perhaps ;)
5) Will you be separating stability updates and enhancement updates?
6) Where's my hover car? If I just subscribe for a month and I have parked it near the rings of Saturn, when you reprocess it will there be a towing fee?

Great news...

Thanks.

Trying again...
#JeSuisCakewalk

Anderton

• Some pretty killer new amp sims (at least I think so )

I'm counting on it, Craig. I always know the sound I'm after, but producing it? Totally never got the hang of amp fiddling, even after spending almost 12 years on-stage.

dwardzala

KPerry
I'm showing my age maybe, but surely the Cakewalk "subscription" model is nothing more than a digital version of good old fashioned hire purchase?  And I can't remember people complaining that the they'd have the nice drum kit they bought on HP taken away if they stopped paying the monthly installments...
 
It's exactly the same model - just digital: you can buy up front, you can buy on HP, and you own the (licence to use the) software in perpetuity when you've paid the requisite amount.  Even if there are no new features, it's exactly the same model...did you expect to get a new cymbal 6 months into your drum kit purchase plan?

That's a very good analogy.

To be more accurate, once you've paid off your drum kit you can choose to keep on paying the monthly HP charge. If you do, then in six months time you may get another cymbal or it may turn out to be a cowbell.
Either way, if your kit doesn't include enough cymbal stands for the new cymbal/cowbell you'll have to keep on paying the monthly HP and wait for the next product fix release to be able to use your shiny new cymbal/cowbell properly.  Assuming the issue of not enough cymbal mounting points gets fixed in the next update...
 
Of course there'll always be those that complain they already have enough cowbells (I don't understand that concept personally!!) so the issue of not enough mounting points is actually a non-issue and you should just shut up whining...