Ddamaged1
i don't understand why they force you to work the midi track by track

as opposed to seeing the whole midi score like you can in sonar's prv.. 

They don't...
You can

sharke

deswind
Better the bugs you know than the ones yet to be encountered on another DAW.
I love Sonar and all its bugs.

Well, there are bugs and there are bugs. The kind of bugs that are just an annoyance and which can be worked around, I'll put up with those. Especially when I know there's a possibility of them getting fixed in the future (even though Sonar has a ton of those bugs which never got fixed despite being reported for years). On the other hand, there are the kind of catastrophic bugs which cause you to lose work, and which have no convenient workaround. Sonar has a few of those as well, and they'll never be fixed. 

Sharke... come on now be real. If Sonar had that many bugs you would have been gone a long time ago. Matter of fact, you wouldn't be here right now. You'd be using that new "90% bug free" DAW of yours that you purchased with a cross grade offer.
 
Not everyone inserts 100 tracks in to their projects.
As a matter of fact, im guessing most of us here (75%) are amateur, hobbyists with about 10 - 40 tracks per project.
Sonar had many little quirks and it also had some long standing bugs But if it were really that bad with "catastrophic bugs" You would have been gone long ago and I would have been right behind you. We both would have been buying new DAW's.
 
Problem solving and trouble tracking (you and I both know very well) can have multiple factors. I might see a bug that you never will because of:
1-  Different hardware, Control surface device
2- I may never use that function the same way you do.
3- I may have a plug in you do not.
 

jjj.fcc
I've never known a COMPUTER PROGRAM where that wasn't true !

Tip. Don't fly planes.

Excusez-moi, je vais poster en français.

Est-ce que tout simplement le programme n'est pas aller jusqu'au bout de ce qu'on lui demandait de faire ?

Il est tout simplement parfait !

Après ce sera une question de plug-ins que l'on trouve pour tous les autres programmes, mais la base est là !

J'ai essayé depuis quelques semaines différents programmes pour trouver une alternative, (évidemment les versions LE) : aucun quoi-qu'on en dise n'est aussi abouti .

Pour ce qui est des buggs, j'ai remarqué qu'ils résultaient de drivers ou de matériel obsolète et non d'un dysfonctionnement du programme.

En tout cas vais garder Sonar le plus longtemps possible !!!


Traduit SGDG

Excuse me, I will post in French.

Is the program simply not going to the end of what it was asked to do?

He is simply perfect !

After this will be a question of plug-ins that we find for all other programs, but the base is there!

I have tried for several weeks programs to find an alternative, (obviously LE versions): no-what we say is also successful.

As for the buggs, I noticed that they were the result of drivers or obsolete hardware and not a malfunction of the program.

In any case will keep Sonar as long as possible!

CakeAlexSHere

jjj.fcc
I've never known a COMPUTER PROGRAM where that wasn't true !

Tip. Don't fly planes.

fwiw, i regularly thank the local deities i'm not involved with developing "life" software (medical, traffic, atc...)

chuckebaby

sharke

deswind
Better the bugs you know than the ones yet to be encountered on another DAW.
I love Sonar and all its bugs.

Well, there are bugs and there are bugs. The kind of bugs that are just an annoyance and which can be worked around, I'll put up with those. Especially when I know there's a possibility of them getting fixed in the future (even though Sonar has a ton of those bugs which never got fixed despite being reported for years). On the other hand, there are the kind of catastrophic bugs which cause you to lose work, and which have no convenient workaround. Sonar has a few of those as well, and they'll never be fixed. 

Sharke... come on now be real. If Sonar had that many bugs you would have been gone a long time ago. Matter of fact, you wouldn't be here right now. You'd be using that new "90% bug free" DAW of yours that you purchased with a cross grade offer.
 
Not everyone inserts 100 tracks in to their projects.
As a matter of fact, im guessing most of us here (75%) are amateur, hobbyists with about 10 - 40 tracks per project.
Sonar had many little quirks and it also had some long standing bugs But if it were really that bad with "catastrophic bugs" You would have been gone long ago and I would have been right behind you. We both would have been buying new DAW's.
 
Problem solving and trouble tracking (you and I both know very well) can have multiple factors. I might see a bug that you never will because of:
1-  Different hardware, Control surface device
2- I may never use that function the same way you do.
3- I may have a plug in you do not.
 

Sonar does have that many bugs, and I thought about jumping ship on a regular basis. I stuck at it though, mainly because a) I really like the workflow of Sonar (when you forget about these issues) and b) I lived in hope that these issues would one day get fixed. And that was the frustrating thing about beta testing. My testing account is full of problems that were never fixed because they were so weird that I couldn't formulate recipes for them. I'd send off a project and would hear back "we're not seeing this at our end" or whatever. The issue with the Quadcurve boosting random bands (reported by others) was a classic example, as is the ongoing issue with some plugins losing their settings. There is a ton of other weird stuff I see on a regular basis but could never formulate recipes for, like for instance sometimes I'll move a clip and when I release the mouse button, it jumps to another position. And a huge number of problems with automation lanes (including them going missing) which caused me intense frustration, ruined entire nights of creativity and caused me to lose work.  And other things which didn't cause crashes or loss of work but which caused serious problems nonetheless, like automation going out of sync with the playhead during looping, things like that. There were loads of stupid bugs which were reported thoroughly by users for years but which never got fixed. Things that really should have been fixed years ago. The MIDI crosstalk problems are such that I have seen projects get to the point where simply pressing one track's mute button can cause a kick drum to sound in a completely unrelated drum VSTi on another track. 
 
You're actually making my point for me in some respects. No, not everyone works with large, complex projects. But a DAW like Sonar should be able to handle them without issues, and if it doesn't then the DAW is problematic, period - regardless of how many people are having a good experience with smaller projects. 
 
Hardware has nothing to do with any of the issues which plagued me, and even if it did, why should it? There has always been a tendency on the Sonar forum to dismiss people's problems as being due to a particular hardware configuration that Sonar could not be blamed for, and I've even heard people cite hardware as a possibility for bugs that clearly had nothing whatsoever to do with hardware. 

I will agree with you gents 100%. This software had bugs, quirks and things that made me scratch my head.
But I stuck with it because I've tried the alternatives, the work flow, the features and Sonar came out on top. Even for its quirks and bugs. it was worth the trade off.
 
If something is that bad, I don't stick around because I am hopeful that it might get fixed. Im frickin out of here.
Its as simple as that.
If something was "Catastrophic" That would only happen once because im not going to let it happen again. 
Im not waiting around for the next time.
 
Anyway, im still using sonar right now
 
Good luck to you guys no matter what you end up doing.
Be happy and find a new DAW if your unhappy. Life is too short to complain over something that's not being developed anymore.

CakeAlexSHere
Anyway... It's history.

time to move on, eh?

c'est dans les vieux pots qu'on fait la meilleur confiture !

probably 95% of the users of all DAWs are hobbyists. One funny thing no one points out: everyone saying what a great and valuable feature and selling point this forum was.... fat lot of good that did-- maybe to the younger crowd the forum is a turnoff

dafunk104
If Gibson is not going to do anything then maybe they would not mind turning it into an open source project.

Although I understand the desire for this, what nobody seems to realize is that if a powerful DAW like Sonar became open source, it would put all the other DAWs (and their employees) out of business. Who'd pay for Cubase or Logic or Ableton or Studio One when they could get Sonar for free? No one. As a programmer myself and someone that thinks a programmer should get paid for his work, I think open sourcing Sonar would be a really, really bad idea.

Kamm Schreiner

dafunk104
If Gibson is not going to do anything then maybe they would not mind turning it into an open source project.

Although I understand the desire for this, what nobody seems to realize is that if a powerful DAW like Sonar became open source, it would put all the other DAWs (and their employees) out of business. Who'd pay for Cubase or Logic or Ableton or Studio One when they could get Sonar for free? No one. As a programmer myself and someone that thinks a programmer should get paid for his work, I think open sourcing Sonar would be a really, really bad idea.

I'm not convinced this would be the case, for a number of reasons:
 
1. There isn't one open source DAW that is in the top 10, and there's a fair few about that are actually ok.
2. There's still a stigma attached to open source, pretty much unfounded these days, but brands and commercial software carry weight.
3. Support is a huge part of using a software product. If you rely on your DAW for making a living you want support you can rely on. Not just bug fixes, or enhancements - you want to know there's someone at the end of a phone.
4. Would people who didn't use Sonar before because they had to pay for it suddenly switch if it became free? Sonar Artist was pretty much fully functional and VERY reasonably priced. Even SPLAT was much cheaper than Cubase or Pro Tools.
 
If Gibson did something like RedHat/CentOS where the program was open source, but you paid for the supported version that would be a great call (they could even charge for different levels of support), but I doubt if they'd go for it. Craig Anderton had some great ideas for additional income streams, but Gibson weren't interested.
 
My bet it Gibson is using Cakewalk as a tax wright-off. They won't make it open source as this will affect its value, and hence the amount of tax they can write off. Once they've benefited from the write-off, maybe they'd be open to ideas, but I suspect they've made their mind up and consider it dead unless a buyer comes along.
 

Well from the various forums that I follow there appears to be a consensus, amongst both users and non users of Cakewalk products, which is a growing dislike for Gibson. They have in almost one voice stated they will never buy anything ever again with the name Gibson on it. Gibson have more than shot themselves in the foot, they appeared to have taken a fatal shot and limped into a hole, never to come out again.